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I can't tell if he has any idea what I'm talking about. I think he just knows something is up and it might be good.

 

We do have a micro bunny. I thought he died up on the main road but I guess that was another one. This one is living in the flower bed by the camper. I hope he doesn't get eaten but he'd only be one bite so maybe if it happens we won't know.

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  • 3 months later...
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My shock collar has a vibrate mode. It does not hurt at all, just wiggles. On walks, I would vibrate the collar if Chester didn't come immediately when I said, "This Way." Pretty quickly, didn't re

For some reason all three of my AIdogs understand the term "this way." If I start going in one direction and then change directions, and say "this way" they follow me every time. Now that's in the p

Update on Nakoma's Recall:   In April (after the jetty incident) I got Nakoma a long 20ft' leash to use for recalling. Sometimes I had it tied to my waist hoping he'd feel a tug when he got to the

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My shock collar has a vibrate mode. It does not hurt at all, just wiggles. On walks, I would vibrate the collar if Chester didn't come immediately when I said, "This Way." Pretty quickly, didn't really need to use it at all. He walks a little a head or stays behind to sniff but comes when I call. When I see a distraction, I usually grab his leash because I am nervous. Thing is, he is much more obedient when he is off leash. He will walk by a person without reacting if I leave him off leash and just call him This Way or tell him to leave it. If I grab his leash, he usually reacts to the distraction. I always leave a longer light leash trailing him, but this is more for my peace of mind than because he needs it. The puppy, Skye, isn't off leash yet but she is past the pulling stage. I use a metal prong collar with her. She is full of energy and can't stand if Chester is up a head of her. I feared she was going to break her wind pipe with a flat collar with all the pulling (and I am not exaggerating. She would cough and gag but keep pulling.) I know people think the shock or prongs are cruel ( I did) but not so. She doesn't pull on the prong. She knows how far to roam without getting hurt and that is what she does even if she sees a distraction. She might run in circles, but she won't pull.

 

I prefer the vibrate because it doesn't need to be adjusted, but even the shock is not to hurt them, it is to get their attention. The level of shock you use depends on the situation. When they are calm, a low level will get their attention, when they are hyped up, they wouldn't feel a thing on low or even doubling the level. I did all my training on my own until recently when I brought in an expert who taught me how to use the shock and prong collar. Don't take these tools out of your bag. My dogs have gained way more freedom from me using these than they would have ever gotten without them.

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Glad this subject came up again. Kaposia still wants to chase cars, and we've been considering the remote shock collar as a last resort. When we go for walks she's really happy on a 12 foot retractable leash and harness, automatically sits at all street corners until we give an "O.K.", but when a car goes by that prey drive kicks in...so dangerous. The 12 foot leash isn't long enough for her to get into the street from the sidewalk, and at corners it's shortened up and locked, so she's never gotten close to a car, but still, that behavior needs to be corrected and it's looking like the shock collar is going to be the answer, as a sharp "No!" and a tug on the leash don't seem to deter her at all.

Edited by LakeGirl
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Well explained SKG...I use the shock collar too, but I have the tone button that gives off a "beep"....safety for them in this day and age with motor vehicles etc is so much different than many years ago when the AIDog could run free without all the modern hazards...would love to go back to those times...I know it's hard no matter what generation but it seemed people had more value about each other and the land years ago....

 

Rik...lol I tell Chhaya "see ya later I'm going this way"...wow does that get her attention....It's like "no Mom wait, I'm coming" look on her face! Then she right with me...

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Wait .... some of these dogs "Autosit" when you stop while leash walking? WOW!

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Tayamni and Coffey both remain on alert and aren't comfortable sitting all the time, OK most of the time ..... at least they stop and 'wait'

They both STAY (well haven't tested a cat walking by outside .. but under normal circumstances) will not bolt out the front door if left open.

 

I have used a shock collar on a previous (non AI) dog, and we had good results with behavior modification - especially that we couldn't physically get to him to get his attention when he was barking in another room.

The collar was the kind that has differing levels, just vibrate and about 10 settings of strength - we never had to go over 3 - the vibration was the best setting after one 3 shock. I felt the 3 it was not that strong but strong enough on this collar. I think it surprised the heck out of him and then the vibration let him know the training aid was there after that. I never used it for punishment.

 

I would recommend testing on yourself first so you know what levels you are comfortable using (start low, not high - lol!)

 

Tayamni at 2 years has calmed down and will follow me out to the car and from the car back to the house - that is a huge step! Then again she used to get up early and is the sleeping beauty princess - seriously she'll sleep in past 9AM. I have to call her to get up for breakfast in the mornings - she used to come out to the kitchen before then as soon as she heard the bowls. Now she probably would be happy with breakfast in bed! She doesn't even go out to potty first anymore - what a change a year makes!!!!!!!!

 

 

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SKG and Maria, would you send a photo or a link to the kind of collar you use? That would be very helpful.

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We've worked on the "auto sit" at corners with Kaposia since she had complete immunizations to go out in public. It's one of the behaviors encouraged by Cesar Milan, and Kaposia really took to it easily. She also has to sit before exiting and entering the house, and when we clip the leash to her harness. On the other hand...we're still working with limited success on "no jump" when she greets new people. Some lessons are more palatable than others I guess, just like with us humans, (like Charlie Brown, I still consider Algebra to be the crabgrass in the lawn of life!)

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I never taught the auto-sit. In Seattle the streets were always wet. I did try, but it seemed cruel. Coyo would do a fake sit, and keep his butt just off the sidewalk. His little bunny fur got very wet and cold. So I went with the "wait". "Wait for me". Then I give the release word and they can cross. Does it matter? I think it only matters that they are paying attention to you and following your directions.

 

The beauty is, every cross street gives you the opportunity to practice. The downside is, if you don't take control of these opportunities, they will. Those are our AIDogs.

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I use the Sport Dog shock collar FIELDTRAINER® 425S http://store.sportdog.com/dog-training/e-collars?swtb=2&gclid=CODFj-jAtM8CFVZZhgodIicLFQ

 

You can get them at Petco, Cabelas, Bass Pro, Ebay, etc...very easy to use and well worth the money...can be set for three dogs also.

Edited by maria
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  • 4 months later...

Glad to see I'm not the only one getting ignored. The only thing keeping Zola with us on an off leash walk is our other dog Max who listens to me like it's his job. He is one of those "best dogs" in most ways. Zola is getting an excellent example from him but she is still under 5 months and I have to have that leash on her way before we need to go (woods, beach or park) or she will coyly wander.

She always comes eventually or lets me get her but it's a game. I try not to play it as best I can but she does it in the backyard too. "Don't ignore me"! I bet the neighbors are tired of hearing that and ZOLA!!!! COME HERE!!! She's so cute and smiley when she does come, I know she knows it and I have to try really hard to not smile when I get stern with her or she smiles and has no remorse. My husband is more effective (aka grouchy deep voice) but I'm the one with her all the time. So thankful for Max, she follows him everywhere. Except loading up into the car. Leaving is boring, let's walk forever.

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Glad to see I'm not the only one getting ignored. The only thing keeping Zola with us on an off leash walk is our other dog Max who listens to me like it's his job. He is one of those "best dogs" in most ways. Zola is getting an excellent example from him but she is still under 5 months and I have to have that leash on her way before we need to go (woods, beach or park) or she will coyly wander.

She always comes eventually or lets me get her but it's a game. I try not to play it as best I can but she does it in the backyard too. "Don't ignore me"! I bet the neighbors are tired of hearing that and ZOLA!!!! COME HERE!!! She's so cute and smiley when she does come, I know she knows it and I have to try really hard to not smile when I get stern with her or she smiles and has no remorse. My husband is more effective (aka grouchy deep voice) but I'm the one with her all the time. So thankful for Max, she follows him everywhere. Except loading up into the car. Leaving is boring, let's walk forever.

 

Hmm this is getting better @ 10 months but I can still see the "whats in it for me going through his little brain" I have not tried a true off leash and today at the dog park a australian shepherd and a lab came when I called before my dog... matter of fact the aussie came everytime ...maybe i need an aussie to get my dog to come...... and as funny as it sounded to me he does listen when i say THIS WAY---thanks miss molly

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Oh this is a great topic!

The head trainer at Petco in my area is going to be putting together an off-leash group course. Of course it will be inside but it will help her gain open field off-leash listening (anyway that's my hopes)!

 

a couple weeks ago the front gate was left open after the trash cans brought to side of house and I didn't notice.

I asked the dogs to sit at the back gate, then stepped paces back and gave the come command. Both dogs did and stopped at me. Then I said "OK" and Coffey tore past me - by his speed I realized there was a problem.

I turned and yelled "OH Sh8T!!!!" Tayamni then following out at a run.

 

Now great two dogs loose in the neighborhood.

All the on leash "Wait"s and the auto-sit practices did nothing to help. Even trying to teach look left and right - before crossing a road ..... Zoom the dogs never broke stride leaving the yard, running across two streets (thank the dogs they weren't busy streets at the time. Disappearing behind houses.

 

Tayamni came back within a few minutes she was going to go her old route - past our home - but there is a house being built there now so the construction fence stopped her. Kelli got her in the house.

Coffey on the other hand, who as a puppy had great recall if he got out the front door and never got out of the yard, got a block and a half from a main 6 lane boulevard. :wacko: We were scared!!!! trying not to panic and calling him but he was having too much fun.

 

Luckily, some one that lives a block away from the Boulevard came out of his house while Coffey was in his yard and Coffey came to him when called.

 

We are constantly training Coffey but he still goes hind brain and not listening. We can't find the remote for the collar (or maybe the collar) we previously had for Roger. I guess I will have to buy a new one. He needs a little extra help. I was going to give it time along with consistent training but after that scare ....

 

This is a major reason I haven't pursued adopting a retired breeder or Nika.

I know bad habits are easily picked up.

 

I really wish I had woods and fields (like the farm I grew up on) to let the dogs run and train off leash in a safe place from an early age.

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Wyot is only just over 4 months, and WAIT works pretty well(which he does, although you have to say it three times or so, because he runs a short distance, then stops, then repeats and looks back at us) and THIS WAY definitely works, because I think he wants to see what is "this way", which is the direction we are going, and there might be something more interesting. TREAT really works well, but there was an occasion when what he was doing and what he wanted to do strongly outweighed the treat... BUT, if I rustle a small bag of treats, he hears that even if a longer distance away than I want him to be, and he comes running- I believe he thinks he might be missing out on something really good, LOL!

 

Granted, we go on trails in the woods, the big field behind our house...but, the trails are getting more traffic (tourists), and I was surprised that when people approached from the other direction, that he didn't just run off...we yelled the WAIT command, and he did, though his rump wanted so badly to leave the ground, and his tail couldn't stop brushing the snow in anticipation! He actually waited until the people were close enough, and then he went for it, not without us trying to discourage the jumping up (which we immediately tell people to not allow him to, and they are all amenable to it). I keep sort of pushing him down as I pet him, and slowly, I think he is getting that he won't get the attention unless he stops jumping.

 

We are socializing him with other dogs, one at a time, not at a dog park (not that there are any where I live, really), sometimes two or three in a social situation, and though he is eager and plays, he sometimes just goes into observation mode. He does well, so far.

We'll see as time goes on!

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  • 2 weeks later...

I'm pretty sure that BeachWolf and I have the same puppy in different packages. Granted, I know they came from the same litter but the similarities are fascinating. Off-leash is not a thing right now. She has jet out of our door twice now through a busy parking lot and nearly gave me a heart attack with the cars going in and out of the complex - not to mention, she made it a game. Chase! (Which I just sat down with some chicken and she came.)

 

We've entered the "I know the command but I just don't feel like listening to you" side eye - to the point where Xochitl is refusing to even sit - in the house or outside.

 

Hiking "season" has started in Austin and I would like to get her to be off-leash when we go to various swimming holes. It is imperative that she stays near (and preferably off leash) and I'm so worried - especially since we have rattlesnakes when you deviate too far from the path.

 

I appreciate all of this fabulous advice though. You have no idea how much I rely on these forums to help direct the pup. I want to be as consistent as possible as early as possible.

 

@ Denise - It is good to know that Petco offers classes like that. When we're officially done with our puppy socialization classes, that is one I want to add to our to-do list.

 

More than anything I have to remind myself, "She is only 5 months old!" and "She is just a puppy!" (Even though she looks like a grown lady.)

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Kuschel, an E-collar might work well in your situation. I spoke to a lady that had a dog that I just was amazed sat amongst a small crowd of people (at our local brewery), and didn't really move from the side of one of her kids. She held a remote, and she told me that this works wonders. She just uses the vibrate mode, and has never had to resort to the shock...and the shocks go from mild to more. She said a command with the vibration has trained the dog to do as she said.

 

I ordered one, and will use it to train him to stay away from the road, and on trails as the tourist season starts to pick up.....he has not shown interest in chasing cars, but we live on a road that has seen an increase in traffic (we are set back a good couple of hundred feet), and since we got him, we trained him to only go in the back of the house (lots of woods there), or up the stairs which lead to the upper level where my garden is, and a five acre field.I usually put him on the leash, and make him sit, so he knows it is a priveledge to get unhooked from the leash, and I am in charge, not him. If I say UP...he immediately runs to the stairs, and knows he will have the field to run in. Interestingly, he waits at the top for me to catch up, lol!!! I guess it does matter what parents they had as to what temperament they get...the only time I get the side eye and the slippery escape,where he runs and flattens himself so I can't get him, is when he has gotten a hold of something that he knows is forbidden in the house. I eventually get him, but I cannot imagine the heart attack and anxiety you experience when you try to walk her off leash! Wyot will be 5 months in 3 days... Good luck, and I'm sure eventually she will get it. Smart little pups these ...... :P

Edited by KittynDoc
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  • 2 weeks later...

What's the name of the e-collar? Please tell us.

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It is called Field trainer 425 by Sport Dog...I've watched the video on how to use it, and funny enough, Wyot, at 5 months, already can respond and do everything... EXCEPT the come here command when he is off leash and not paying attention because he is too busy doing something more interesting than coming for a treat (although he does eventually come, lol!) So, we shall see how this goes. I will also work on "heel" with him, as he tends to get very excited and walks ahead of me, either on leash or off....

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  • 3 weeks later...

The newest thing I use to get Zola back quickly every time on a walk in the woods or beach is a stick. I hold up the stick and offer it from a distance as a potential game and she comes running. She may know she's getting tricked but sticks make her lose her mind for anything else so for now I use the stick to get her leashed. I know I need to train her to actually listen to me, but I'm certain she will eventually as she is becoming SUCH A GOOD DOG! Seriously sweet and funny and at 6 months, quite mature in many ways. We just adore her sunny little personality.

Edited by BeachWolf
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Wyot had a wonderful 6 month birthday yesterday!! It was 78 degrees up in the MOUNTAINS of NY....stick used to bring him running. NO way does that work now..I can just see the bubble above his head "I'm tracking something much more interesting than a stick..potentially, it could be a deer bone, some deer poop..." very occasionally does the raised stick work. He is better at recall, but the teenager in him is kicking in.. They truly are such good dogs, and so happy and funny, and in my case, Wyot loves to come for a cuddle. Sometimes when he is not sure of what is going on, or what he hears or sees, he goes to the door, barks a little, then comes and does a slight jump/tap on my lap or hip, then sits on my lap, or presses against my leg and waits, wanting reassurance. I LOVE this.

 

It takes time, and just when you think you've got them trained....the little stinkers show you just how intelligent and independent minded they are! :wub:

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It looks like Coffey got the same Petsafe collar that Nakoma got. Like Nytebyker, I tried it on me first and it is an irritation NOT a shock like electric fencing is.

It reminded me more of a tense unit with differing strengths. I think I've had tense units used on me with more irritation as this never made my muscles twitch.

 

I think the new name being used is "Remote training collar" and that seems to fit at least the unit I bought.

 

I have 30 and 50 foot leads and used that with Tayamni but, well, the same training did not produce the same outcome with Coffey.

These dogs are individuals and that is one of the things I love so much about them!

 

Even though Tayamni will run off-leash, I'm not sure the RTC would be effective for her with her Therapy Dog personality.

She will benefit from more long leash work ... I need thinner long leashes so she doesn't wrap up on things.....

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Denise E.
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  • 1 year later...

I think we may be joining team Ecollar too---we had a great trip up the oregon coast and things were going great -Zuni was recalling to my whistle and even though he does not come all the way back he returns. But each day he got a little worse deciding to say hi to that dog first and then coming back ..and then on day 3 he was sniffing the rocks by the trail pretty far ahead of me and just made a left turn off the beach and up a hill towards the road...I think it was chipmunk smells but no amount of whistling my head off even made him look back. I caught him before things got dangerous BUT that was not a fun experience ! I want him to be able run free but not wherever he wants. He is a great dog and he can turn on the afterburners and go but I need to be able to get his attention too. Im glad to hear some are waterproof.

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