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Wyot & Whining!


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#1 KittynDoc

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 09:20 AM

I've never really had this problem before, but in the last month or so, Wyot has taken to whining ALL the TIME. I've tried many different things to stop it, but not successfully as of yet. 

 

It's been beyond ridiculously cold here, so of course our outdoor activities have been curtailed a bit, but we do take him out on runs and small hikes as temps allow. He goes out numerous times into the yard, sometimes by himself where we can see him, to sniff, dig a little and chew some sticks as well as do his business...he always comes in happy and most of the time, after 5-10 mins, without being called in. I take time to play with him, letting him tug, chase and go after a rolling toy that has a handle, which he loves. 

 

So, when he is not paid attention to (we have to work on the computer, do housework, etc.) he follows us around and WHINES, and WHINES, to the point where I want to scream!!!!!! The worst whining, I must say, is when we take him in the car (he LOVES going out for a ride, knowing adventure is coming, or simply going on an errand with us- like the Post Office, or grocery stop). I make sure he does his business (both ends, lol!) before going in the car, because I know the excitement can heighten the need to go....that taken care of, I always tell him he is a good boy, hoping that will settle him, but, he is on patrol- staring ahead, looking for oncoming cars, still trying to chase them as they come by.....at home, in the yard, he has no interest in the traffic that passes by the house, and does not chase cars...so, I am not understanding this at all.

 

Any ideas on how to handle this?? Get him out of the habit? We praise him, pet him for a little so he knows we do not ignore him. We also give him a bully stick or a horn to chew on, then say ok, we need to work, go sit, go chew your stick (he knows the words chew and stick, as well as lay down and sit...even wait, he knows, and will do it, when he knows that food will be forthcoming or something else- and will stare at either one of us the whole time, then 5 minutes in, he will start whining again....<sigh>....

 

Thanks in advance for any help!



#2 Denise E.

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 10:51 AM

Tayamni went through a stage of being whiney.  She was 2 yrs old when it started?  I can't remember exactly.

It was more for attention, I got to where I would ask her what she needs and then if she just starts whining when I talk (like she is trying to talk over me) then I TSSSK her and give a stern look and a hand gesture to be quiet.

Coffey did more whining for excitement while in the car and it has been harder to reverse but he has grown out of it with encouragement to do so.  It took different techniques (treating, ignoring etc).

 

I treat if she is quiet for 6 -10 seconds, so she correlates the treat with the quiet not the whine.

 

Nowadays, she whines when she wants something, or if she feels that I am not walking or feeling well.  She also nudges the back of my knee when I am not moving steady.  She is almost 3.5 yrs now.

Every now and then she still does attention whine and she knows better.

 

Our Mom's Cheweenie, Ginger, is a barker and barks a lot if Mom leaves Ginger home.

Guess who picked up on this when visiting this Miss Ginger .....   Coffey did!

 

How does one stop incessant barking when no one is home?????

(We hear it when in the yard, we hear it when getting into the car, and also our neighbors tell us the dogs have started barking when we are not home).

 

I have a feeling the root of this barking is similar to the whining.



#3 KittynDoc

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 11:04 AM

I use hand gestures as well, and he stops for a moment, looks insulted, and then starts whining again. When I ignore it, he whines louder...then he plops down loudly, with one big huffing sound, and either sits regally and stares at me, daring me to look so he could get attention, or puts his head down in a "feel sorry for me" position, occasionally looking up with his eyes, to see if I notice...LOL, I swear these dogs are half human!!!!!!!



#4 LakeGirl

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Posted 16 January 2018 - 09:24 AM

We've been dealing with similar issues. The weather has been extremely cold, and right around New Year, we both went down with the flu for about 7-10 days. Kaposia was pretty good with the lack of exercise and a messed up routine for about a week, then she started snatching contraband items and chewing them up for attention. No whining, but it has been back to snatching...anything paper or fabric. We've dealt with it the best we can, short walks when it warms up to 20 degrees or so, and lots of time in the fenced yard when she wants it, but the cold is an issue for her too. Before too long she's coming to the door "three leggin' it" because her paws are cold. We really keep an eye on her when she's out. I have every confidence this will resolve when we're all back to the normal routine. On another topic, our son and his family were with us for 3 nights and 4 days just before New Year, and I am so happy with the way Kaposia relates to and plays with the three grandkids. She plays a mean game of tug with the older boys (they know not to let her win, and they always end the game.) When the little 2 year old granddaughter wants to play with the "woof", Kaposia is so gentle. Elise offered Kaposia the rope once, and Kaposia gave a big tug almost pulling her over. After that whenever Elise offed her the rope, Kaposia took the other end and just gently led her around and around in circles, and that became their game. She realizes that the little girl is different than the big boys.....pretty smart and intuitive!
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#5 DarmokElizabethontheocean

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Posted 16 January 2018 - 05:26 PM

Darmok just started the whining thing. After I determined he was ok, I told him "quiet" which is one of the first few commands he learned. I also whined loudly back at him a couple of times. He has since stopped.

#6 KittynDoc

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 04:58 AM

...oh, Wyot knows the QUIET command...but his stubborness outweighs that most of the time. I also have whined back at him (he has that cute/dumb look on his face when I do that, and then he doubles the whining, and it sounds like air coming out of a balloon!!! LOL!! I'd keep laughing if it was not so frustrating sometimes).

 

I am trying to hone in on what may make him do this. In the car, I think it is excitement, but if we go on long trips, he does NOT tire of whining!!!! I even tell him he is a good boy, so he knows we appreciate what he does (protecting us from the big bad oncoming cars??...which works for exactly a minute, then right back to his whiny song).

 

I also used the shhhhh, with my hand in front of my lips...which also works for just about a minute or so. Things I've noticed: when hubby is at work, he does not really whine most of the day. In the mornings, we each go to our corners to drink our morning coffee, answer emails and the like. Wyot has gone out for a little morning jaunt to do his business, gets his daily pettting/cuddles from each of us...but he seems to whine more when we are in seperate rooms! He goes from me, to hubby in the kitchen, and keeps trying to "herd" us to be together is what my sense is telling me! When I finally go in to the kitchen to cook breakfast, he seems to settle, and knows that at the end of this, he too will recieve breakfast...go figure. But, of course, we cannot always be in the same room together, so dunno what how to resolve the whining...<sigh>...hopefully my persistence outweighs his stubborn streak, and he learns..and it is a stage. One can hope!

 

Thank you for the suggestions!



#7 Denise E.

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 09:07 AM

I know Wyot usually gets a lot of exercise.  Is winter slowing that up a bit?

I really think they go through a teenage phase where they want to be center of attention!!!!  :blink:

 

Coffey has a higher prey drive than Tayamni and is reactive - we have worked on this with him since way before he was a year old.

He is much better and we can get him back into front brain quickly = before he goes full rear brain.

So part seemed to be an age phase and part due to his prey drive level.  Consistency, sometimes consistent ignoring (when at the house and he was doing it for attention). 

He used to do the same that Wyot does in the car only with pedestrians and bicycles and skateboards etc.  Coffey is stubborn also.

I feel your pain.

 

I have pulled the car over and made sure he started focusing on us and listened to commands like 'sit' and 'focus' then treating when listening before starting off again.

Of course he would start up again sometimes and it could be a long trip to the dog park!!!!

 

He is much better now, not perfect.

 

We are going to join a nose scenting class soon.  It should help even more with his focus.  We have the treat games but he is stubborn and doesn't like doing them too much.

The nose scenting class should be more of a challenge for him.

Especially since he hasn't been able to sheep herd in almost a year.  Next year he should be able to get back to doing that for fun.

 

Are there any classes like that or agility or something that Wyot can get into?  Any of those type classes make them use their smart brains and will provide a different exhaustion to compliment trail hiking.

 

Good luck!   :)



#8 Denise E.

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 09:13 AM

PS I've done the whine back also.  It was when I got tired of ignoring and then it's kid of like when I say "Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah"  to them.  It makes them stop and think.

When I whine - It is more sarcastic than their whines and I go on for a couple minutes.  Which ever one that is whining for No Good Reason - gets the message I'm done with the whining.

I make a weird face too when I whine like that at them and then glare shortly when I finish - the whiner offender is always the first to blink or turn eyes away.

 

I get a lot of head turns from the dogs - like they are saying - you're NOT speaking English!!!!?????!!!!

 

We all howl together sometimes.  I've been lucky I guess that neither ever whined along with me.  I think it's because I make it that way.



#9 Samie

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 11:28 AM

Kittyndoc, is he anxious when he's trying to get you and your husband into the same room? Kinda sounds like he's trying to be the alpha and protect the two of you, but is uncomfortable in the position and it's stressing him. 



#10 KittynDoc

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 12:24 PM

Kittyndoc, is he anxious when he's trying to get you and your husband into the same room? Kinda sounds like he's trying to be the alpha and protect the two of you, but is uncomfortable in the position and it's stressing him. 

It does indeed, doesn't it? This has been the routine for us from day one, so it isn't new. He won't stay by me unless I keep petting him, which I can't do the whole time, obviously.

 

This winter has impeded our outdoor activities a lot, because it was just too darn cold for anyone to be out for long! That may be part of his boredom and whining...as in "someone DO something!" I do play with him in the house, tugging and chasing etc. as room allows, but I'm sure that is not enough. Today it hit 30 degrees,  and when we went out in the foot of snow that fell overnight, he was in his glory, running, jumping and shoveling snow with his snout!!! 

Coming back in, though, he gives me the sorrowful look, and just like a child, will give me the doggie "pout" and whining starts..Really at a loss to resolve this!  :unsure:



#11 woodrat

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 03:08 PM

Oh the whining... by far my least favorite of Rune's many 'quirks', even worse than that blood curdling scream he does when he sees something he can't get to. (At least the scream stops.)

 

Rune was relentless. It didn't matter how many times I took him out to exercise, the whining would start up again immediately upon returning indoors. I ignored it... because nothing I ever tried did anything to stop it, and everything I tried involved giving him attention in some way, shape, or form, which only seemed to make him do it more. It's a form of communication after all and in theory communication should eventually cease if it's only ever a one way street. The problem is that it seems to also be self-soothing, so in some way it made him feel better. In general he is quite vocal about making his feelings heard, so I suspect he just really needed to voice his inner turmoil - which was a nonstop teenage fit of 'WHY CANT WE DO FUN THINGS ALL THE TIME'.

 

The good news is that Rune is nearly 3 now and the whining has largely ceased. The bad news is that I don't have many helpful suggestions aside from simply making them so exhausted they can't stay awake any longer. The incessant whining is largely why I started hooking Rune up to things and having him pull stuff...it exhausts him far more than anything else, enough so that when we get home he crashes on the couch and doesn't get up until dinner time. Unfortunately that kind of a physical work out is not recommended for yearling dogs because their bodies aren't quite done growing yet, so until they're a bit older you're simply out of luck. Unless you can find something that can exhaust them mentally enough that they crash, but I never could. A two+ hour off leash walk in the woods would also do the trick for a while, but that was hard to fit into the schedule every single day.

 

Though Rune is about a thousand times better in general now, the whining has crept back into the scene a bit the past couple weeks. My hours at work have increased which means less time to exercise the dogs and seasonally we're in an awkward period where we don't have enough snow on the ground to pull a sled, but too much snow to pull a bike. He hasn't been getting the workout he needs at least a couple times a week... and it's starting to show. When he starts up again I tell him to 'go lie down', which is his settle command. It puts a stop to the pacing that usually accompanies the whining, but the whining still drifts across the room from his bed.

 

The following video is something all you whining sufferers might find amusing.. it was taken when Rune was about 7 months.. I was working on an art project christmas gift and knew I'd be tied down to that spot for a while, so I had exercised Rune substantially beforehand. He was confined to the kitchen with me and provided with numerous fun interactive toys as well as a bully stick (none of which he ever touched). My art project took 5 hours and we took a break halfway through to go out and play with the flirt pole. He never. stopped. whining. He just started throwing in these hilariously dramatic 'woe is me' howls that I had to try REALLY hard not to laugh at, lest I reward his tantrum with the attention he so desperately sought!

https://www.youtube....h?v=C-hCUBDPtiA

 

One other note: for those of you suffering outlandishly cold temperatures preventing you from exercising your dogs - dogbooties.com makes cheap cordura booties (the kinds sled dogs use) that will make your dogs feet last longer in single digit temps. We can successfully walk for two hours in single digit temps with negative wind chills if the dogs are wearing these boots simply because it puts one extra layer between their feet and the cold. They will walk funny when you first put them on (or if they're like Rune they'll freeze in place and start wailing...I've got a video of that too), but once you get them outside and walking they forget about them pretty quick. They'll stay on walking through deep snow too! Those things have been a lifesaver in the frigid temperatures we've had recently.



#12 DarmokElizabethontheocean

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Posted 17 January 2018 - 03:50 PM

When I read these threads, I really understand why Kim does an interview first to get one of these dogs. They don't seem like your regular run of the mill dog and takes a certain type of handler. I can't imagine having more than one puppy at a time. Darmok has really increased my dog training skills, that's for sure (and patience, and physical strength hmm and ability to love...yep I love this dog -until he whines again that is)

#13 KittynDoc

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 06:06 AM

woodrat, thank you for your insights and" the tales of whining", lol!! These dogs truly are one of a kind...I agree, it is the inactivity that gets their goat, and AI's are so much more than most dogs...they really communicate, and yes, at 15 months, I would imagine he is a teen, being a bit bratty at times when as you said- "why can't I play ALL THE TIME!!!"  :blink:

 

Unfortunately, my hubby's patience sometimes runs short (he's getting things together for work and his commute, and he has "Wyot Underfoot" as we call him sometimes)...and it doesn't help at all, just increases the whining, because then he feels unsettled...when hubby goes off to work, it seems like Wyot settles finally. Only one person to follow, only one person to ask things from, and me, he is unlikely to get his satisfaction if it is unwarranted. He listens to my commands a little more, because I am the one that does most of the training/disciplining, though if hubby stops and uses MY words, then he listens. I use his kibble, one at a time for treats, and he knows they are in my pocket. He runs circles in the field, finds a stick I throw, even if it lands in 2 feet of snow, I see his doggie body halfway under, until he emerges with it, throws it, catches it and runs towards me (he has been known to drag a huge tree branch that just seems impossible for us even to lift!!!!) They need a lot of brain stimulation as well, it seems. He can figure things out right quick....just wish the whining would leave, LOL! I guess we are stuck with that...I do believe if he had a sibling, this would also lessen a bit....or would the whining double?!! Instinct tells me they'd entertain each other, and the boredom would be less...  <_<  :)

 

Oh, and...the video!!! Oh my, these dogs are something else, lol!!!!! 5 hours...WOW!!!! :blink:  :D  

 

Thanks again for chiming in, everyone!



#14 Samie

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 06:59 AM

They need a lot of brain stimulation as well, it seems. He can figure things out right quick....just wish the whining would leave, LOL! I guess we are stuck with that...I do believe if he had a sibling, this would also lessen a bit....or would the whining double?!! Instinct tells me they'd entertain each other, and the boredom would be less...  <_<  :)

 

I have a friend that did scent training with her dogs in the house for mental stimulation. She would take cardboard boxes and put a peanutbutter kong inside. Then she would duct tape it shut and put that inside of several other boxes. It's messy to clean but the dogs always had a great time. I know she started it with just a few boxes at a time. Alternatively you could try playing games of hide and seek with the kibble.

 

It sounds like it's not much of an option to let him outside right now, so finding some other stimulation might be your best bet. 



#15 KittynDoc

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 11:14 AM

I have a friend that did scent training with her dogs in the house for mental stimulation. She would take cardboard boxes and put a peanutbutter kong inside. Then she would duct tape it shut and put that inside of several other boxes. It's messy to clean but the dogs always had a great time. I know she started it with just a few boxes at a time. Alternatively you could try playing games of hide and seek with the kibble.

 

It sounds like it's not much of an option to let him outside right now, so finding some other stimulation might be your best bet. 

I like the box idea...how much fun is that!!! I just vacuumed...but box pieces are SOOO much easier to clean than shredded tissue or paper of any kind, LOL!!

 

He has a ball kong that is pretty big, is see through, so you can see the smaller ball inside, and has two handles. He LOVES this toy, but though he rolls it around a lot and then lays on his back with the usual AI positions of happiness, he comes and places the ball on my lap, or pushes and pushes while holding the ball, and getting riled up- ie., it is NOT a toy that he can be busy with all by himself. He needs me. It is a great toy, though.  For outside, hubby found the greatest toy ever- a flying squirrel frisbee made from the makers who invented Chuckit! ball thrower...not only can you see the bright colors if it falls in the snow (bright blue and orange), but it is rounded on the ends, with a flat, rough nylon surface. He runs like crazy when I throw this, then he shakes it like he would prey, in his mouth, and then he tries to chew it, but because of its shape, he can't really grasp it and tear it apart, and I can get it from him easier (drop it and give it is not an option when he gets this in his teeth!). Win win on that one, and the short jaunts out right now make him run like the wind, and we laugh so much at his antics ! (you know, jumping on his "prey", jumping like a jack rabbit through the snow, snuffling while his head is halfway under the snow...it is endless)...

 

I will let you know how the box in a box thing goes!  :D



#16 woodrat

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Posted 20 January 2018 - 05:36 AM

Another fun thing to do with boxes - especially for younger pups - is take a big ol' box, cut a bunch of slits all over it, and wedge ALL their toys into it to create one giant interactive literal toy box. This was Rune's favorite thing when he was a nugget! He would chew on it, yank on it, tug it, thrash it, shred it, and, when all was said and done, sleep in it.

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=gsHr3J1ea-A

https://www.youtube....h?v=S2Ev-R9Z1H4



#17 KittynDoc

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Posted 20 January 2018 - 06:46 AM

Awesome videos!!!! Wyot LOVED the box in a box in a box thing...it kept him busy for a good half hour or more, and at the end, he pooped out on the floor next to shredded pieces of cardboard, his head half in one of the medium size boxes!! :P  :D  He did watch me construct the box, saw the ball go in, a few treats in each, and then I shook the boxes once I taped them shut....his look of anticipation was priceless! He pranced into the living room doing his "dance of excitement", which is when he knows something is for him...thanks for the suggestions!



#18 Eflemma

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Posted 22 January 2018 - 12:17 PM

Mo, started this while riding in the truck. We used a muzzle grab, as we did for mouthy behavior, with the quiet command and it worked well.



#19 Denise E.

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Posted 22 January 2018 - 12:40 PM

.......   https://www.youtube....h?v=gsHr3J1ea-A https://www.youtube....h?v=S2Ev-R9Z1H4

 

 

Those videos are priceless!!!!!!   :)

 

I all of a sudden could remember Tayamni being that size!  :wub: 

   Oh my puppy ........   (my how she has grown)

 

 



#20 KittynDoc

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Posted 22 January 2018 - 01:10 PM

Mo, started this while riding in the truck. We used a muzzle grab, as we did for mouthy behavior, with the quiet command and it worked well.

I will try the muzzle grab....and see what happens....






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