Jump to content


Photo

Perianal Fistula


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
32 replies to this topic

#1 puckmonkey

puckmonkey

    Advanced Member

  • IIDOBA Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 36 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling

Posted 18 July 2012 - 09:06 AM

Well, my AID Ed has been diagnosed with perianal fistula (aka perianal furunculitis or perianal pyoderma). It is a chronic autoimmune disease. It is most likely to be genetic and is almost exclusively found in German Shepherds. It has no cure and is very painful. Sugery is not an option because the side effects outway the pros. Most cases end in euthanasia because it ends up being too stressful and painful for the dog. It is expensive and extensive to treat and treatment does not work for all dogs. Currently Ed is on the strongest medical treatment right now, so we will see how it goes. My Vet told me it is the worst he has seen. This disease happens to middle aged dogs between 5-7 years old. He is not even 2 years old yet (he will be 2 Aug. 18). Things arent looking good for my little Ed and I regret to say that I will have to euthanize if he doesnt respond to treatment. He is in so much pain and there is nothing I can do to help relieve it. All I can do is stand by and watch. Has anyone else ever had any experience with this disease? I am so dissapointed that my AID is not healthy like he should be. I was told that this breed has good genetics but apparently my dog has very bad genetics. I am discouraged with my AID experience and will most likely not be getting another AID. I love Ed and he has been such a good dog so it breaks my heart at the thought to have to lose him so soon.

#2 Sherab

Sherab

    Advanced Member

  • Moderator
  • 2351 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Sanford Michigan
  • Interests:Wishing you Joy, Blessings and Wisdom

Posted 18 July 2012 - 09:39 AM

Puckmonkey,

I am so sorry to hear this. I have GSDs but have never heard of this illness. You've probably googled too but here are a few links that might have some helpful information. It does seem that there's no good or proven pathway, some have luck treating it and others not. http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/bulletins.read?mnr=416335&pagen=2 I found some information on food sensitivity. Good luck. http://www.ehow.com/way_5333351_diet-dog-perianal-fistula.html Good luck to you and Ed. Very sad.

#3 Starghoti

Starghoti

    Jasper and K'ne's Mom

  • Moderator
  • 2352 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:planet surface
  • Interests:camping, crafts, computers, dogs and training, gardening, nature, & being outdoors

    There is a difference between my personality and my attitude.
    My personality is who I am, my attitude depends on who you are.

Posted 18 July 2012 - 09:42 AM

Our sympathies.
No words can help, I know.

Our thoughts are with you.
"There is no such thing as a hyper dog. There are only exercise dependent dogs."
 
"Where I go, Dog follows. Where I stop, Dog settles. When I am lost, Dog finds me. When I am joyful, Dog joins me. Who I am, Dog knows. What I need, Dog becomes. Dog is great. Dog is good. Dog is everything. I am Dog codependent."
 

#4 Sherab

Sherab

    Advanced Member

  • Moderator
  • 2351 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Sanford Michigan
  • Interests:Wishing you Joy, Blessings and Wisdom

Posted 18 July 2012 - 09:45 AM

Another good link. http://perianal-fistulas.tripod.com/MainIndex.html

#5 miz molly

miz molly

    Advanced Member

  • Moderator
  • 3433 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:ben lomond california
  • Interests:My 4 legged friends, photography, music, painting, hiking, fishing, the beach, and a good cup of coffee in the early morning.

Posted 18 July 2012 - 09:46 AM

Puckmonkey, so sorry to hear about Ed's condition. I did a bit of investigation, and found more information for you on www.peteducation.com and http://www.merckvetmanual.com Take a look, there is some helpful information there. My thoughts are with you, and hope that Ed is one of the lucky ones whose symptoms can be controlled.
When one tugs at a single thing in nature, he finds it attached to the rest of the world. ~John Muir

#6 maria

maria

    Advanced Member

  • IIDOBA Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 691 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:PA
  • Interests:My AIDog Chhaya...herbs, gardening, the outdoors.

Posted 18 July 2012 - 10:28 AM

So sorry Puckmonkey.....my thoughts are with you! I can't imagine how you feel......I don't mean to change your mind on AIdogs, but no matter what breed there are issues with health.....some issues can be environment and diet....I honestly don't know about perianal fistula, so I will look these websites up to get more informed! Thanks for letting us on the Forum know what has happened with Ed. I pray Ed will live in the least amount of pain....thankfully he has an owner who cares deeply and will take the best care of him as possible! Take care and know that all of us on the Forum will be here for you!
We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.

-Ancient Indian Proverb-

#7 maria

maria

    Advanced Member

  • IIDOBA Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 691 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:PA
  • Interests:My AIDog Chhaya...herbs, gardening, the outdoors.

Posted 18 July 2012 - 11:01 AM

Puckmonkey sounds like from the websites I have been reading it seem they think it's more immune mediated....
http://www.gsdhelp.i...uto/afOURS.html
below is the first couple paragraphs from this web site......maybe trying to build Ed's immune system could help.....just a thought!

Maria


Anal furunculosis, or peri-anal fistulas, is a chronic, progressive disease affecting the tissues surrounding the anus of the dog. It is particularly common in German Shepherd Dogs and their crosses. The clinical signs of perianal fistulas may be present for years, gradually worsening over time. A fistula is defined as an abnormal passage or communication between an internal organ and the surface of the body or between two organs, and it is typically seen as multiple draining tracts, in this case surrounding the rectum. With perianal fistulas there is communication between the rectum and the perianal area. Clinical signs may include tenesmus (straining), dyschezia (painful elimination of stool), constipation, licking of the anal area, and mucopurulent anal drainage with an odor. The end result may be anal stricture or fecal incontinence.

The cause of perianal fistulas has yet to be definitively determined, but evidence currently suggests that the condition is actually immune mediated. The German shepherd dog is the most common breed affected, but it may be seen in other large breed dogs such as the Irish setter. The typical age of onset is from 5 to 7 years. In the German shepherd the condition is believed to have a definite immunologic basis with inflammation of the entire large intestine (colitis) occurring. Many of the breeds which suffer from perianal fistulas tend to have a broad sloping tail head which may actually predispose them to the formation of fistulas.

Here's a little more info on the end of the website.....diet may help!

In cases of financial hardship, prednisone has been used with some success. Ancillary use of antibiotics may also be of benefit, especially when faced with secondary bacterial infection.

To prevent reoccurrence, a novel protein diet (a diet whose protein source the pet has not been previously exposed to) is suggested, good anal hygiene should be implemented, and the anal area should be monitored for fistula recurrence.

We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.

-Ancient Indian Proverb-

#8 Sherab

Sherab

    Advanced Member

  • Moderator
  • 2351 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Sanford Michigan
  • Interests:Wishing you Joy, Blessings and Wisdom

Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:20 AM

I did a forum search on the word Perianal and only got one hit from 2009. It was a thread on pros and cons of spay/neuter. Since people are encouraged to share health and behavioral issues here as a sounding board and support group I think there's a good chance of a hit if it happened to anyone else in the recent past. I have to say that there is a good deal of transparency here. I've seen posts on everything from aggression to bone mice. My read on PF is that it's cause is unknown, much like Human MS. There are genetic theories (why more women than men?), Environmental theories (why more northerners?) and infections disease theories but no smoking gun on the mechanism. My heart goes out to you. It's terrible to see them suffer and it's terrible to lose them before their time.

#9 judyk

judyk

    Advanced Member

  • Forum Moderator
  • 837 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Northern Michigan

Posted 19 July 2012 - 05:51 AM

Having been on the forum from inception and having seven of these creatures, this is the first time we've ever heard of this particular health issue. Our hearts go out to you and Ed and like Maria said above every breed has health issues, ours included. While I'm not going to attempt to change your viewpoint on AIDS, give yourself time to deal with Ed and his health before you say no, never again. This is an extremely sad and trying time for your family, I completely understand, as we've had issues with some of our kids too but please don't make any final decisions on your feelings for the AID breed. If there's anything that Larry and I can help with, email me off the forum.
[font=Comic Sans Ms]

Judy in Michigan

#10 woodrat

woodrat

    Advanced Member

  • IIDOBA Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 348 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:NH
  • Interests:The dogs, photography, drawing, taxidermy, needle felting, hiking, dog behavior.

Posted 19 July 2012 - 11:08 AM

This is heartbreaking. I can't even imagine what you're going through. If T were to come down with something like this... well, my whole world literally revolves around this dog right now. Devastating wouldn't even begin to cover it.

I also had never heard of the disease, but I saw this post last night and spent several hours educating myself. I suspect I can speak for all of us when I say that this is a very scary thing to have pop up in these dogs.. Everything I've read says that there does indeed seem to be a genetic link in addition to other unknown or speculated factors, but that genetic aspect is what scares me the most. However, I do not think that this means that the breed has 'bad genetics.' As others have mentioned, it sounds like this is the first known case of the disease in AIdogs and as such, it would be impossible for Kim to have avoided something he didn't even know there was potential for in the first place. Any time you're working with a rare breed and therefore a small gene pool, you're always at risk of having these kinds of things crop up - especially as you get further and further down the generations. This is also precisely why Kim continually introduces new bloodlines whenever possible and undoubtedly why these dogs have been able to stay healthier than most. I do remember Kim telling me during my interview, when I asked if he was aware of any health concerns among any of these dogs, that the only ones he knew of were the occasional under bite, some (very few) recent instances of unknown-cause non-epilepsy-related seizures, and some allergies in some dogs. Yesterday I kept reading that PFs and allergies often went hand in hand, both being autoimmune related - which makes me wonder if perhaps there's a link between the two in Ed's case. (I think I remember you having trouble with him chewing/licking his legs also, which is often a sign of allergies). Come to think of it, Kim also warned me against overvaccinating because he was suspicious that it could be related to the random seizures that had occurred in a small handful of dogs that had been stumping vets - that also would be related to an autoimmune issue if the excessive vaccines were weakening the dogs' systems.

In any case, thanks to your letting everyone know the situation, hopefully we can use this as a warning and a learning experience.

Have you tried a topical zinc oxide cream with Ed? According to this site, quite a few folks have had good results with it, and it's cheap, which I know is very important because the rest of the treatment is most certainly not: http://perianal-fist...m/ZINCOFAX.html
I think you can use it in addition to the oral medication.

I also found a link to a genetic test offered in Finland that has been accepted by the OFA according to this site:
http://germanshepher...rianal_Fistulas

Here's the site of the company that does the testing (the PF test is the 'Anal Furunculosis' one):
http://www.genoscope...m/en/tests-dog/

It sounds like there is likely more than one gene that may contribute to this disease, but that there is at least one that they've been able to link to it for sure and that dogs with two copies of this gene WILL pass it on to offspring. Unfortunately the test to determine whether or not dogs are carrying this is not inexpensive.

I hope others will report back to Kim as well if their dogs end up coming down with this... I think the more informed he is the better a chance he has at doing whatever he can to avoid it in future generations.

I am so sorry you're dealing with this, Puckmonkey. I wish you all the best with the treatment and with keeping Ed comfortable. I read of several cases of this disease last night on the GSD forum, including other 'worst case the vet has ever seen' ones that did eventually respond to treatment. Don't lose hope yet.

#11 puckmonkey

puckmonkey

    Advanced Member

  • IIDOBA Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 36 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling

Posted 19 July 2012 - 06:48 PM

Thank you all for the kind thoughts, encouragement and all the helpful information. I will keep you all updated about Ed and how he is progressing.

#12 judyk

judyk

    Advanced Member

  • Forum Moderator
  • 837 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Northern Michigan

Posted 19 July 2012 - 08:05 PM

Remember that you are NOT alone in dealing with Ed's trauma. We're with you every step of the way in spirit!
[font=Comic Sans Ms]

Judy in Michigan

#13 Karen

Karen

    Advanced Member

  • IIDOBA Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 1704 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Woodinville WA
  • Interests:Photography, drawing, painting, cooking, dog training, film making

Posted 24 July 2012 - 08:38 PM

Puckmonkey, this is heartbreaking news. I'm sure you love your dog as much as I love mine, and I can't imagine going through this with one of them. I hope your time with Ed is full of love.
I do beautiful, wild, unique abstract photography.
www.karenhyams.com
And here's my dog Danza
custom_dog_nema2_small.jpg

#14 Gib

Gib

    Advanced Member

  • IIDOBA Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 654 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lynnwood,WA
  • Interests:Hiking, snorkeling, grandchildren, dogs, community, computers and ....

Posted 25 July 2012 - 05:47 AM

I am still spending large portions of my day leashed to Wicca during her recuperation. Our 12-week goal is just two weeks away.

I spend a lot of time thinking of you and sending blessings.

For Now,

Gib Curry

ф

"Things work out best for those who make the best out of the way things work out."

#15 maria

maria

    Advanced Member

  • IIDOBA Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 691 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:PA
  • Interests:My AIDog Chhaya...herbs, gardening, the outdoors.

Posted 25 July 2012 - 06:12 AM

Puckmonkey thank you for keeping us posted.....as you can see from the responses this is a very caring group!!!

Gib thank you too for all your updates too....I think of these pups and the owners as a "PACK"....a large one but a awesome one!!! My thoughts wander to "THE PACK" many times during a 24 hour period....... ;) wandering and hoping all is well for everyone!
We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.

-Ancient Indian Proverb-

#16 Sherab

Sherab

    Advanced Member

  • Moderator
  • 2351 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Sanford Michigan
  • Interests:Wishing you Joy, Blessings and Wisdom

Posted 25 July 2012 - 10:29 AM

I would totally echo Gib and Maria. Ed and Wicca are in my evening prayers.

#17 Sherab

Sherab

    Advanced Member

  • Moderator
  • 2351 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Sanford Michigan
  • Interests:Wishing you Joy, Blessings and Wisdom

Posted 25 July 2012 - 02:18 PM

Here is a web site with a wheat free food that has a lot of great testimonials from animal owners that have sentient beings with all manner of allergies including gluten intollerance and GI issues that have done well on this diet. Sounds like this has a shot of helping. http://www.earthbornholisticpetfood.com/us/testimonials/

#18 puckmonkey

puckmonkey

    Advanced Member

  • IIDOBA Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 36 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling

Posted 25 July 2012 - 10:58 PM

Update on Ed. I have been treating Ed with Cyclosporine which is an immunosuppressant drug along with Ketoconazol which is an antifungal drug that helps the body have less severe reactions to the cyclosporine and helps the cyclosporine absorb better and last longer. He has been on treatment for a week now and I am seeing a small response. The bleeding and fluid leakage has stopped. He is still severely ulcerated and painful but at least I can see that the medicine is starting to work. This just confirms that it is an autoimmune disease since it is responding to an immunosupressant drug. I asked my vet if changing food would do anything and he said that it is not allergy related so it probably wouldnt have an effect on this particular disease. He still does not have an appetite and continues to lose weight. This is a problem because he needs to eat with this medicine or he will vomit it all up and then it will not work so I have to force feed him when I give him his meds. I hope he will continue to hold out for the full treatment and start to show more improvement. This is somewhat good news but not good enough. He is not close to being out of the woods yet. I willl continue to keep you all updated. Thank you all for your thoughts.

#19 miz molly

miz molly

    Advanced Member

  • Moderator
  • 3433 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:ben lomond california
  • Interests:My 4 legged friends, photography, music, painting, hiking, fishing, the beach, and a good cup of coffee in the early morning.

Posted 26 July 2012 - 05:32 AM

Dear Ed,
It's not fun to be as uncomfortable as you are at the moment. And we know Puckmonkey is in total anguish over you, and so worried he can't sleep at night. We hope you can beat this perianal fistula disease and you get better real soon.
Lick a bone, it will make you feel a tiny bit happier.
Thinking of you daily,
Tolinka and Two Step
When one tugs at a single thing in nature, he finds it attached to the rest of the world. ~John Muir

#20 Sherab

Sherab

    Advanced Member

  • Moderator
  • 2351 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Sanford Michigan
  • Interests:Wishing you Joy, Blessings and Wisdom

Posted 26 July 2012 - 03:59 PM

Poor, poor Ed.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users